Dec. 22 - 28, 2006

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In Business Q and A
Bob Faiss, Lionel Sawyer & Collins
Interviewed by Stephanie Tavares / Staff Writer

Bob Faiss is a gaming attorney at Lionel Sawyer & Collins.
Photo by R. Marsh Starks

Bob Faiss , chairman of the gaming law practice group at the state's largest law firm, has participated in gaming law regulation in Nevada since its birth in 1959, when he worked for then-Gov. Grant Sawyer and in his 34 years working for Lionel Sawyer & Collins.

Faiss has been intimately involved in gaming law through several significant changes, from giving mobsters the boot to licensing international gaming operations to paving the way for mobile electronic gaming. He has also been instrumental in developing the next generation of gaming attorneys through his work as an adjunct professor at UNLV's Boyd School of Law.

Q. I understand you were a journalist before you became a lawyer, what prompted you to make that change?

A. Well, my lifelong goal at an early point in my life was to be a journalist because I thought of all the professions available to young people that was one that gave me the opportunity to work for the public and to bring about change and to right wrong and I never have lost that feeling about the field of journalism.

I had a transformation from a beginning with the Las Vegas Sun as a new reporter at the salary of $60 a week and at the time that evolved into becoming the first television script writer for the first television news program in Las Vegas and the night correspondent for the Associated Press, when it did not have a bureau here. Those three responsibilities, which took about 80 hours a week, paid me a salary of about $125. But I wasn't in it for the money. But what happened was when Grant Sawyer, whom I thought was a great hope for the future of Nevada, became governor after he was elected in 1958, I received a call to join him in his administration and I took that. And through that involvement in politics it led me to law school and the practice of law and my first and only job has been with this firm that he and Sam Lionel created in Las Vegas.

You've had some controversial clients, including Mike Tyson and former Horseshoe owner Becky Binion Behnen. What are important factors for a gaming lawyer to consider when a client is controversial?

Becky Behnen may have been newsworthy but I would not describe her as controversial. She is a wonderful person, motivated by the best impulses. In her gaming career as owner of the Horseshoe, she always sought to do the right thing. My relationship with Mike Tyson was too limited to provide any guidelines for representing clients with an international visibility. I spent only a few hours with him. I found Mike Tyson to be an intelligent and competent person.

I think we represent only clients that have a fundamental character in the area of gaming and if they do not, if we find qualities about them that we think will make them unsuitable for gaming, we do not become involved. And the fact that a matter is controversial doesn't necessarily mean there is anything wrong with the company or the person. And regardless of whether there is controversy or seemingly unanimous approval of a person our preparation for representing that person is the same. And that is just complete dedication to making sure that everything necessary to be covered is covered.

Gaming law is currently composed of a small group of attorneys. It is perceived as difficult to break into that practice. Is that changing?

It is changing. I think that looking over the period beginning when I started practice in 1973, when there was no such thing as a gaming attorney, that has changed. For a long time there was a small corps of professionals that, by the performance of their work, they earned a worldwide reputation. What has happened now, and I think the Boyd School of Law has had a lot to do with that, education has added to experience, enabling them to break through. One member of my class that I teach in gaming law and policy at Boyd has become member of the attorney general's staff for the gaming division. Another one is a very promising second- year member of a firm that has already earned a reputation in gaming law.

What would your advice be to younger people, maybe high school or college students, who want to become gaming attorneys? What do they need to do to get into the field?

Well, a lot of the advice would go to any job. And that is knowing what the rules are and obeying those rules and making a full commitment to what is necessary to learn how to do that job. And that commitment to ethical behavior should be present in everything you do, whether it is socially or in business. Reputation is an awfully hard thing to build, but it's easy to lose it by one wrong decision.

What are you teaching at UNLV?

The gaming law and policy program at Boyd right now, (which) is under the direction of Dean Richard Morgan and Professor Steve Johnson who is the gaming law faculty adviser, is a one-year program. The first semester, titled, simply Gaming Law is an overview of all aspects of gaming law, concentrating on Nevada. The second is titled Gaming Law Policy. And the purpose of that is to find ways to engage the students in the actual influence of gaming law and policy.

"To accomplish that they've done such things as identifying a conflict in the Gaming Control Act, created the legislation necessary to correct that conflict, took that legislation to the legislature, arrange for its introduction and then testified before the judiciary committees to show the merit of it. That legislation was passed unanimously in both houses.

Dean Morgan believes the Boyd School of Law, in association with the UNLV Gaming Institute, has the potential to be the nation's center of gaming law education. Dean Morgan and Professor Johnson have spent a good deal of time in preparing a proposal that will begin progress toward that goal.

Dean Morgan is retiring at the end of the academic year, what are your feelings on that?

My hope is that one, he'll change his mind, but two, that even if he does carry through that he is going to be present. He has a strong interest in gaming law and he has given us the latitude and leadership that enable the success of the students. He does have an ambition for enhancing the gaming law program. He developed possibilities for that enhancement which I probably shouldn't discuss; I'll leave it to the dean. But he does see the potential that the Boyd School of Law can be the leading gaming law education institution in the United States, simply because we're at the core of the United States gaming industry. We have some of the greatest legal minds, some of the greatest business minds and some the greatest regulators here. Altogether this creates a climate where the innovative practice and learning of gaming law should flourish.

Any plans of retiring yourself someday?

No. No, I don't plan to retire. A notable Las Vegas psychic once foretold that I would probably die at my desk at an advanced age. I accept that prediction.

A number of out of state firms have merged with or acquired Las Vegas law firms. Others have entered the market by hiring top lawyers in the city, including several from your firm. Where does the trend leave Lionel Sawyer & Collins and why?

The movement of major national and regional law firms into Nevada is a tribute to the viability and promise of our economy.

I think the trend has made Lionel Sawyer & Collins stronger than ever. We have the core strengths and the loyal clients not to be affected by the issue. And we applaud the quality of the firms that have come into the state and the decision of those who accepted the merger offers. They have resulted in good firms. But we think the one thing that sets Lionel Sawyer & Collins apart is simply the stability and the wealth of Nevada knowledge. Any problem that affects Nevada we have someone within our organization who is experienced in some part of it and in many respects were responsible for creating the present law and regulations that guide that area.

Do you see the influx of more regional and large firms as having a positive influence on the legal community?

The influence you hope you will have from any change in any sector of a profession is that it serves to create a uniform commitment to the betterment of the state as well as to the clients that the firms serve.

How are firms reacting to competition over top attorneys?

Competition for top lawyers is taking place in virtually every major city in the U.S. This competition is not just at the top level. Competition for the new lawyers just out of law school has pushed starting salaries in Las Vegas to the $100,000 range.

Keith Monro is joining the Gaming Control Board this year when Bobby Siller departs, how will this change the board?

We've had a number of people serve on the board and commission since the modern gaming control system was created under the guidance of Gov. Sawyer back in 1959. And in large respect the decisions are influenced more by the quality of the people who are making the decisions rather than guidelines set out in statutes. And even though the personalities have changed the uniform fairness and stability of decisions has remained unchanged.

Overall the board and the commission have been largely responsible for the stability of regulation that has been a large attraction for investment in the gaming community. And the change of one member for another has never changed that. Bobby Siller has been an exceptional member of the Gaming Control Board. He's the first Nevada regulator to be voted outstanding gaming regulator of the year.

Keith Monro is an excellent choice for the post. I've witnessed his work as chief of staff for the governor of Nevada. There is no challenge he's going to face as a Gaming Control member that he has not met and mastered as chief of staff for Gov. Guinn . The qualities I think he brings to the board, they're going to make him exceptional because he has the experience of knowing how government works. He knows the gaming industry. He has been aware of the issues that have affected gaming control throughout Governor Guinn's term. He's a good attorney and he has the ability to look at a complex situation and determine which really are the relevant parts necessary to consider for a decision. And he has, in my observation, just a good deal of solid common sense.

How has the board changed since the early years?

I think the Gaming Control Board has not changed. The statutory structure for the board has remained the same; That you have to have people who meet certain criteria to be appointed.

What has changed is the mission of the control board. When Grant Sawyer appointed the first members of the control board back in 1959, he recognized that the leading problem for the Nevada gaming industry was to survive and the greatest threat was the perception around the country and especially in Washington, D.C., and the Department of Justice was that the gaming industry was corrupted by the underworld. In his first welcome to the Nevada Gaming Commission he said, "If there are any people here affiliated with the underworld in the gaming industry, get them out. If they're not here, keep them out. I want you to hang tough on this issue." Well, that's not the issue anymore. Nevada won. No one today would say there is any underworld corruption in Nevada gaming industry.

Today they have challenges that are just as demanding, dealing with other countries in the worldwide regulation of the gaming industry because the gaming industry has become multinational and the principal figures in it are largely those that have worked in Nevada and are based in Nevada and have done so much to build Nevada up. They are dealing with the most complex financing plans for bringing investment into the gaming industry. You have to be very sophisticated in order to analyze and make judgments on those systems. As to whether they maintain the same qualities as Nevada has always demanded for financing of the gaming industry.

There is a great expansion of electronics as a force in the gaming industry, forcing them to deal on the highest level of technology in order to evaluate what is proper and what is not for the industry. An example of that is the wireless gaming technology that Cantor Gaming , an affiliate of Cantor Fitzgerald a worldwide renowned financial services firm, has brought about through creating the legislation that made it possible two years ago and the enacting of regulations implementing the new venture.

They now don't have to worry about whether someone is with the underworld or not because usually no one who is, is going to try to get into the industry. That's still important but it's not a threat at all. These other things are a threat to stability. They have to be able to make sure whatever new comes in, that it is given not only a thorough evaluation but a rapid one. The world in many respects moves so fast, they have to make not only the best possible decisions but they have to make them as quickly as circumstances allow.

So getting back to the original point, the quality of the gaming control board and commission has always been of the highest, we never have had any scandal that has affected any aspect of gaming control in this state because of the quality of the appointments that governors have made and the support they've had from the infrastructure in Nevada and the industry itself. But the mission has changed and it's possibly more demanding than it ever was.

As the casino industry gets bigger and its projects and deals grow as well, what regulatory changes would you propose or support?

The most valuable strength of the Nevada gaming control system is its stability. This is one of the reasons Nevada gaming is so attractive to investors. Change in government regulation has not been made unless there is good reason for it. Any change should be approached carefully. I trust that the governor and the Legislature will continue to give priority to budget and staffing for the Gaming Control Board. It is vital for our future that the Control Board have all the resources its awesome responsibilities require. This is especially important in the fields of electronics and financing analysis. The staff members of gaming control agencies are exceptional. Their ability and experience need to be retained.

There are a couple of minor changes I believe would enhance the gaming control system. The first is to ensure the independence of the Nevada Gaming Commission by providing it with a larger support staff and an independent budget for research and education. The second is to authorize the Gaming Control Board to hire attorneys as part of its staff to deal with day-to-day legal needs and to be part of enforcement and investigative teams as circumstances require. Further, a way should be found for the Gaming Policy Committee to be more involved in the review and creation of major policies. That committee is chaired by the Governor and has membership from the Legislature, the gaming control agencies, the gaming industry, Indian tribes and the general public. In the early years after its creation in 1961 during the administration of Gov. Grant Sawyer, the committee was active but it has since fallen into disuse as an influence on gaming policy.

Of the following, which regulatory role is most important and why: a) Protecting the image of Nevada's gaming industry. b) Protecting gaming consumers to make sure gambling is fair. c) Collecting gaming taxes d) Keeping unfit operations out of the industry.

As we said earlier in our conversation, I teach gaming law and policy at Boyd. And just last week I wrote the examination for this semester and this is typical of a question I would ask. And the answer is without each of these components, without each being fairly and strictly applied, then you don't have gaming control. So there is no part of gaming control that you can isolate and say is more important than the others because the gaming control system has evolved over the years since 1959 and things have changed and so the system may be somewhat different but the importance of everything that has survived and been added has an equal importance. You can't take one away and claim that you have a successful gaming control system because experience has shown that this has been important in some respect in overall to give us the type of system that not only is successful but wins the respect of people in the state and outside the state.

What was your role in getting the mobile-gaming law changed and regulations adopted?

I was the lead Nevada attorney for Cantor Gaming. The lead person in the company was Joe Asher, who is the managing director of Cantor Gaming and who in the interim has since become a resident and proud citizen of Nevada along with his wife. He has married since this whole process got started.

But the role with Joe Asher and the individuals from Cantor Gaming was to determine the prospect for creating change in the gaming control system to allow mobile gaming. In that process we worked closely with the Gaming Control Board and the Gaming Commission and their staff to determine what needed to be done and how it needed to be done. But once that was established, together Joe and I created a legislation in accord with the guidance of the gaming control authorities, presented it to the legislature, Chairman Bernie Anderson, who is on the Judiciary Committee, was instrumental in having it adopted.

Joe Asher and I were witnesses before the legislative hearings and the influence of Joe Asher and the creation of that legislation was recognized by Gov. Kenny Guinn. Joe Asher was the only one that Gov. Guinn invited to the signing ceremony for the mobile gaming bill and since that time I've worked with Cantor Gaming to have them become the first mobile gaming company to be licensed by Nevada, or anywhere else for the manufacture, distribution, operation of the wireless gaming systems and worked with them in the creation of the regulations that have been implemented for that.

Did the mobile gaming regulations turn out as the developers hoped?

I think the regulations are fine. Nevada's system has been uniform throughout its history that you do not have government regulators make the rules without full input and the opportunity to demonstrate what needs to be done from the gaming industry. This was a cooperative effort throughout and I think both the regulators and the industry are satisfied that the regulations are just as good as anything they do.

How do you think the technology will be used?

Everything that has happened thus far, my role is as an attorney to deal with aspects of it that need an attorneys work. So what I know about the success of it I read about and hear about. I'm not directly involved in the marketing of the system at all. But everything I've read and heard is that it has a great future, not only in Nevada but throughout the world.

How will casinos prevent children from using them?

That was considered by the Legislature. It's a concern shared by everyone involved to make sure they are not used by minors. It's no different than it is with slot machines or anything else on the gaming floor, with respect to minors. And they will have protective features built in that will make it very difficult for anyone not authorized, minor or adult, to use the device.

Do you think Internet gaming will ever be allowed in Nevada?

It's at the U.S. Congress. The Legislature has given the Nevada Gaming Commission the authority to adopt regulations to have Internet gaming, so it's no problem with state law.

A lot of the requirements for the implementation of the state law, that the commission find that the operation of the Internet gaming can be done in compliance with all applicable law. And there are applicable federal laws that the Justice Department says prevent it from being legal. So it would take an act of the Congress, but once it does, Nevada is in the best position of any state to take advantage of it, should it decide to do so. The Nevada law allows approval of intranet gaming systems, and at least one such system has been approved. Nevada gaming authorities require that any intranet gaming operation must not cross Nevada's borders.

A lot of private equity funds are getting involved in the gaming industry. Where do you see that going?

It's a development that has caused a lot of excitement. There is money available for investment in the gaming industry - a great deal of it - and the Nevada gaming industry has a lot to offer to investors. Just how that is going to work out, it's worked out so far, we have models for it and those models have worked from everything I know. It's going to be a decision for the regulators to make.

What does that trend mean for gaming attorneys?

Any trend in gaming law, because it is such a very sophisticated area of practice, it's going to make it more demanding on those who want to claim the title of being a gaming law practitioner. There is so much in dealing with a new technology or a new movement such as private equity financing that depends on a solid knowledge of not only the law and the regulations but also the policies that have been developed over the years because you can't make a decision involving private equity finance without knowing the history of what the approach has been to financing and ownership of companies in the past.

What does it mean for gaming regulation?

That remains to be seen thus far. There is a model for private equity acquisition of casinos that fit within the present structure. It would be up to experience to demonstrate whether there is any requirement to change the law in any respect to better enable the regulators to make the proper decisions.

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